---
title: "Why are there 12 notes?"

description: 'Love music more! Let''s talk about the origins of pop music, and why the fifth is considered so "perfect."'

status: complete

date: 2021-04-29

kind: solo

guestSlugs: []

listenUrl: "https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/lovemusicmore/episodes/Why-are-there-12-notes-evsvk9"
appleUrl: "https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/why-are-there-12-notes/id1567355195?i=1000521554657"
spotifyUrl: "https://open.spotify.com/episode/0PpTYftSkA1T0DrCfjrTQ3"

topicsDiscussed:
  - "Microtonal music"
  - "Origins of Musical Notes"
  - "Pythagorean Theorem"
  - "Perfect Fifth"
  - "Mathematics in Music"
  - "Western Music Tradition"
  - "Frequency and Pitch"
  - "Cultural Perspectives on Music"
  - "Circle of Fifths"
  - "Equal Temperament"
  - "Artistry vs. Structure"

hostNote: |
  In this solo episode, I delve into the intriguing question of why there are **12 musical notes** in Western music. I explore the concept's roots, tracing back to **Pythagoras** and his fascinating ideas about sound as mathematics. The episode examines how this seemingly arbitrary system shapes our perception of music and the implications of focusing solely on the perfect fifth.

selectedMoments:
  - label: "Pythagoras and Musical Notes"
    startSec: 1
    note: "I discuss why we only have 12 musical notes in western music, emphasizing that it's entirely arbitrary."
  - label: "Perfect Fifth Concept"
    startSec: 90
    note: "I explain the mathematical ratio of the perfect fifth and demonstrate it with musical notes."
  - label: "Cyclic Nature of Fifths"
    startSec: 227
    note: "I recap how we get those 12 notes by progressing through perfect fifths."
  - label: "Exploring Octaves"
    startSec: 183
    note: "I suggest focusing on perfect octaves for a more inclusive view of music beyond the standard 12 notes."
  - label: "Cultural Arbitrary Nature of 12 Notes"
    startSec: 455
    note: "I argue that the concept of 12 notes is somewhat arbitrary and shaped by historical context."
  - label: "Music Beyond the Twelve"
    startSec: 502
    note: "I preview upcoming episodes about how notes can work together in harmony."

excerptQuotes:
  - text: "So yeah, for real, we're actually going to talk about why we only have 12 notes in western music."
    startSec: 85
    reviewed: true
  - text: "Just naming something perfect definitely gives it a lot of weight. The reason why he was so into it was it was a mathematical ratio of three to two."
    startSec: 46
    reviewed: true
  - text: "So Pythagoras said three to two ratio. Let's keep that up and start stacking notes."
    startSec: 89
    reviewed: true
  - text: "We're back at A. We reached the same place that we took off from. And so that's why we end up having 12 notes."
    startSec: 224
    reviewed: true
  - text: "It's mostly just arbitrary. It's just because that group of people conquered most of the world."
    startSec: 450
    reviewed: true
  - text: "It's not like we had to. It's not like we go see aliens and they're going to be listening to pop songs with power chords, which is a root and a perfect fifth."
    startSec: 543
    reviewed: true

faq:
  - question: "Why are there 12 notes in music?"
    answer: "The twelve notes in Western music stem from arbitrary historical choices rather than some universal truth. This episode examines the mathematical and cultural origins of this system."
  - question: "What is the perfect fifth in music?"
    answer: "The perfect fifth is a musical interval defined by a frequency ratio of 3:2, significantly influencing Western music."
  - question: "Who was Pythagoras and how did he influence music?"
    answer: "Pythagoras was a Greek philosopher whose exploration of the relationship between numbers and musical harmony laid the groundwork for understanding musical intervals."

transcriptPublished: false

draft: false
---